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TOPIC: CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus

CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus 5 years 2 weeks ago #929

  • Cirrus
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As those who have ordered a carbon mast know already we are experiencing some supplier related problems and are late in delivering masts to you. Carbon tubes have been delivered from NZ to Whites in Brightlingsea who are assembling masts. However they are now facing severe problems with supply of the custom Allen Brothers spreader brackets in the UK and they may not be able to complete more than a handful of masts prior to the Nationals.

We are not there yet and Whites may still be able to deliver all 22 masts ordered in good time (the plan is to build 30+)- but I wanted to keep all of you fully in the picture.

In the event we cannot meet the full ordered quota in time for the Nationals we will not deliver any carbon masts so that nobody feels disadvantaged. In other words the event will be run in 'Alloy' as in the past - those already with carbon masts and no M7 available could then either borrow a new M7 mast from Cirrus for the event or may be accepted as legitimate entries with carbon masts by the CA with a percentage place penalty on their recorded results.

Carbon masts would then be delivered immediately after the National championships - and we would make several available there for inspection.

I will issue an update on this statement later this week if we have further news to report.

Regards - Mike Lyons
Cirrus Raceboats Limited
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CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus 5 years 2 weeks ago #934

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UPDATE ... Saturday 11th May

The current prediction is that ALL those who have already ordered a carbon mast to date and are currently listed as entering the Nationals in early June will get their new masts in good time. The tubes to do this are already in progress here in the UK

Tube assembly has already been completed on this batch with only a few now still needing processing in Brightlingsea ..... and we simply await more of the custom spreader brackets from Allen Brothers to issue the lot.

The second major batch of mast tubes from NZ is awaited and will fulfill all other outstanding orders for carbon masts ... with enough for us to at last to maintain a proper (buffer) stock level of completed masts.

Mike L. (Cirrus)
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CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus 5 years 1 week ago #939

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Hi Again

As builders of the Blaze and suppliers (very soon indeed - projected to be end
of next week now) of the carbon mast option we have a plan that might be of interest to many of you – whether or not you are intending switching to carbon masts atsome point.

1)As the carbon mast alternative is increasingly taken up there will inevitably
be a large number of redundant alloy M7 masts around.

2)HALO, the large sail version, will continue to use the stretched alloy M7's
for the foreseeable future.

We believe it possible to re-use the Blaze length M7's for Halo use with a
larger sail being the only significant item being required.

a)The Blaze M7 mast would be set more upright (like Halo).
b)This will only necessitate a couple of shroud `extenders' and possibly a new
(shorter) forestay in addition to a re-developed Halo sail.
c)Everything else is standard Blaze equipment.
d)We are already in discussion with sail makers and this development will
commence from August onwards.
e)The likely sail area, subject to water testing, is approx 10-12% larger than
for the Blaze – ie the approximate size of the current Halo sail.
f)Existing Halo rig will be able to race on equal terms with this (slightly)
shorter mast version.
g)If/when original Halo sails come up for replacement the current (longer) Halo
masts can be reduced to 'Blaze' length for further Halo duty.
h)We(Cirrus) are suggesting that 'Halo racing' does not allow any alternative
mast material for a period of at least 5 years … and that period can be extended
further subject to a Halo users vote.

I am very interested to know your views on this concept as soon as possble -
either directly using email or via this or the Blaze 'Yahoo'forum. The Halo rig has a number of very enthusiastic devotees already ... most of them using their Halo rigs as an occasional alternative to their Blaze racing.

IF the only `entry cost' was a Halo sail and not `sail+mast' we think a few more
will want get involved.

Regards – Mike Lyons (Cirrus)
Last Edit: 5 years 1 week ago by Cirrus. Reason: typo
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CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus 5 years 1 week ago #940

  • whizsplash
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So are you saying that as and when I receive my new carbon mast, I will (with little effort) be able to stick a bigger sail on it?
I know that you have said alloy only, but it doesn't take a great leap of faith to see the available options.

Well I suppose that will give an option if the 'gust response' on the carbon stick is a bit too effective and the lightweights all appear to benefit.

Then again - that would be another dilution of the class?

And yes I am feeling a little grumpy today! :angry:
Rob
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CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus 5 years 1 week ago #941

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Hi Rob

Heck - I'm only trying to get all views on this one and be constructive ! Inevitably it is sort of 'damned if we do and damned if we do not :(

The carbon Blaze mast WE are getting is not some cheap whippy bit of wet pasta with a pretty outer 'cover' - it had to be able to take the standard sail so is a tad stiffer than some of the more 'off the shelf' offerings out there. The whole point of our custom development for the Blaze was to keep the crew weight demographic identical. This was in part the reason why the tubes took so long to source from NZ - we simply could not get the right stuff here. The 'lightweights advantage' stuff you read about other classes experience does not necessarily apply here - Those 'lightweights' masts will be identical to yours, nobody can select a different grade in this class.

Class dilution ? REAL heavyweights do suffer in most conditions already even with the M7 hence the option for Halo. They race Blazes but at club level and do enjoy their current Halo option. It keeps quite a few with us rather than encouraging them to move onto other classes. I'm not heavy enough .. and I don't think you are either ! I have no wish to go on a mega diet of pies and pasta and I would not recommend it either. What I am saying is that it is not a serious option for many but for those who are 'north' of 100kg or so we should continue to offer something ! If it can be done economically then why not ? I cannot see any dilution to date - where are the 'rival' clashing Halo meetings ?

Mike L. (btw not at all that grumpy really B)
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CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus 5 years 1 week ago #942

  • Myles Mence
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Dear Mike

You are confusing people.

We are seven months on from the AGM and people are only now receiving their carbon masts and beginning to tune them - and with an element of urgency in time for the Nationals.

In to this mix you are now suggesting larger sails on the old tin masts.

One step at a time or you won't carry people with you. We don't know the crew weight implications of the carbon masts yet. Indeed helms of Rob's size may be very quick with the carbon mast (I hope they are).

If after a while however the real heavyweights are compromised by the new mast -and there is general realisation that this is the case - then that is the time to trial a larger sail on the old tin masts. But this is an issue for the Halo "class association" not the Blaze Class Association.

Myles
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CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus 5 years 1 week ago #943

  • pipwarner
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Gents,
It would appear from your recent posts that there is now a general acceptance that the introduction of carbon masts into the Blaze class will have an effect on the performance of the boat. This is not, although feared, how this introduction/acceptance of a carbon mast was pitched at the AGM meeting. What measures will be introduced to ensure the one design class remain equal and keep each and every boat, new or old, with or without carbon, competitive without further development.
We need to keep the Blaze and promote its true quality not introduce a Blaze XL.
Proud to be a Blazer,
Pip 637.
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CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus 5 years 1 week ago #944

  • Myles Mence
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First time out with the new carbon mast today - it transforms the boat.

Conditions were a light north easterly never above 12kts and one could feel immediately the boat was more responsive, rode more easily over the waves and the top section began to "work" in the gusts, such as they were. Also the sail sets better in the very light stuff, one can induce a little bend which avoids the creases one can get with the old mast. (The sail sets fine as the breeze increases too!).

Relieved of the weight up front the motion of the boat in waves was quicker and more than once nearly caught me off balance.

I have stepped the mast more upright than with tin mast and my current setting is 7100mm with tightish rig. I will come back with more figures when I have sailed with it a few more times.

The mast is good quality with a good finish and Cirrus must have put a lot of time and energy into producing this item. Thank you Mike.

Myles
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CARBON Masts - update from Cirrus 4 years 11 months ago #949

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Hi All

We have started issuing pre-ordered carbon masts - there should be plenty for anyone who has previously ordered for delivery before the Nationals. Our next batch is being released this THURSDAY.

Pleased contact Cirrus by email to discuss handover arrangements. We can also bring masts to the Nationals or even keep them here until afterwards.

Regards - Mike Lyons
Cirrus Raceboats Limited
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